Kim Iversen: Joe Rogan BLASTS Fauci For FLIP-FLOPPING, Ruining Public Trust In Health Experts

Kim Iversen: Joe Rogan BLASTS Fauci For FLIP-FLOPPING, Ruining Public Trust In Health Experts

[Music] so kim what’s on your radar well last week on a show joe rogan the host of the world’s most listened to podcast expressed his frustration with fauci and other health officials for failing to admit when they just don’t know rogan teared into fouchy on the joe rogan experience and blamed him for mistrust in science saying quote there’s also a problem with people like him where they make these statements that you’re led to believe they have an understanding of the situation but then it turns out they’re 100 percent wrong but then they come up with a new statement and you’re supposed to believe that rogan said when they don’t know they never say we don’t know they don’t say this is very confusing and we’re trying to figure it out as we go along now rogan isn’t alone in his frustration millions of americans remain unvaccinated refused to wear masks we’re adamantly against lockdowns and now with the booster shot coming many who currently did get the two-dose vaccine are saying they don’t intend to get the third you know because like now they want us to do all boost these boosters we were talking about with andrew i mean i don’t want a booster i look i never wanted the vaccine i took one for the team and that’s and by the way you know who doesn’t get a lot of vaccines the millennials i know a lot of millennials especially the 20 20 olds they don’t want it they don’t want it they don’t think they need it they’re probably right but i tell them i didn’t want it either i took one for the team but a boost but every eight months you’re gonna put this in me i don’t know about that maybe i don’t need one i don’t wanna one size fits all many of the news outlets and people in our own families communities and friend circles place the blame squarely on the anti-vaxx mask lockdown crowd for the pandemic continuing screaming at them to just follow the science as if this crowd is turning to pagan rituals of spell casting instead and the current talk of mandates and passports are often not discussed as a matter of public health but almost as a form of punishment for the unvaxed a modern day witch hunt if you will but can you really blame people for not listening to the public health officials when they like rogan stated so often seem to counter their own directives change them or end up being flat wrong in regards to mask mandates in february and march of 2020 every major public health institution and numerous experts asserted masks weren’t necessary for healthy people the u.s surgeon general even tweeted quote seriously people stop buying masks they’re not effective in preventing general public from catching coronavirus but if healthcare providers can’t get them to care for sick patients it puts them and our communities at risk fauci asserted the same thing saying there’s no reason to be walking around with a mask harvard public health experts agreed with the surgeon general in fauci saying masks offered little if any protection were more of a reflexive reaction to anxiety over the pandemic the cdc director at the time dr robert redfield told congress healthy people should not wear a mask but by april of 2020 the tune drastically changed the surgeon general was demonstrating to the public how to make cloth cloth face masks the cdc was advising masking in all public settings where six feet of distance couldn’t be maintained fauci claimed the only reason why he said what he said was to preserve inventory for medical professionals but not everybody changed their stance leading to even more public confusion the who maintained masking was unnecessary for the health healthy public until later in the year many other health professionals debated and still debate the effectiveness of masking when it came to lockdowns what started as a plea by healthcare workers to help slow the spread to prevent overwhelming hospitals turned into locking down until we crushed the virus and ended the pandemic in april of 2020 fauci warned easing lockdown measures too soon would lead to a big spike in cases but by may of 2020 fauci began to warn against extended lockdowns claiming they could result in irreparable damage and unintended consequences including for health nonetheless despite fouchy’s warnings local public health officials and politicians continue to enforce extended lockdowns in parts of the country then there are the vaccines when masking didn’t end the pandemic and lockdowns didn’t either the public and health officials hoped the vaccines would be the magic bullet but despite both ceos from moderna and pfizer saying covid will never go away and will likely be with us forever like the flu that their vaccines will likely be annual many public health officials in the news media have asserted the pandemic will end if everyone gets the vaccine fauci himself stated he didn’t think it was likely kovit was ever going away knowing what we know about immunity and coronaviruses but confusingly around the same time he was also saying he believed we needed 60 to 70 percent of the country immune in order to reach herd immunity but he didn’t stop there a month later he began saying in television interviews 70 75 was needed only to then change it up to upwards of 85 percent in an interview with cnbc what was going on well in a telephone interview fauci admitted he was moving the goalposts he claimed partly based on new science and partly based on what he thought americans were ready to hear and that goalpost shift isn’t just for the percentage of her reach to reach herd immunity some countries like israel have reached very high levels of vaccination and yet are in a major surge of cases hospitalization and deaths showing the vaccine wanes in effectiveness against the delta variant because of the new data emerging from israel and other countries what was once a two-dose vaccine to be considered fully vaccinated has now shifted to three doses and now fully vaccinated people must wear masks as data continues to emerge that they are just as infectious as unvaccinated people bringing us back to the hypothesis first stated by the vaccine ceos and even fauci himself that this virus is likely to become endemic meaning it will be with us forever like the flu now we can’t fully blame the scientists part of the scientific method is guessing testing and either failing or confirming and then doing it all over again because this is a novel virus and a situation many of these experts haven’t found themselves in before it’s understandable that they would get some things wrong but the problem is the misleading statements and the definitive assertions they’ve said do this and this will happen lock down and the virus will go away wear a mask and the virus will go away take the vaccine and the virus will go away and then are forced to backpedal and reverse their statements entirely into a more nuanced stance but this hasn’t come without serious harm to our lives despite the obvious effects the pandemic has had on us all we have suffered immense community erosion because the authorities have flip-flopped around people are picking and choosing which contradictory statements to believe families friends and neighbors are now pitted against one another with team a and team b both able to cite the exact same experts for their differing opinions they should have told us from the beginning this was going to be scary because they couldn’t give us definitive answers on something new and unknown that their directives would shift as they knew more they should have been open to testing and investigating any and all theories rather than resorting to censorship and delegitimizing experts and scientists who had differing opinions many of whom ended up being accurate but they didn’t in many cases they did the opposite of what was needed to build public trust so alyssa i’m curious if you think had the officials been more upfront with we just don’t know that that would have actually helped or do you think that would have made things scarier for people so it’s i think the overall great topic and very well said so i was um in the white house during the early days of the pandemic when we were sorting through this different data and i tend to agree with your assertion that had we just come out and said this is a totally novel virus we simply do not know on certain things these are our recommendations but they may change down the road that would have at least set kind of a trajectory of increased public trust i do know uh surgeon general jerome adams who you cited at the time had advocated for not wearing masks and that was an internal decision we made because people were hoarding them and we didn’t have enough for frontline workers but in retrospect it would have been much better to say we need to preserve these for frontline workers do not buy them but i remember weighing this question in the situation room and part of the discussion was but if we say that there is a portion of the public that’s going to think well goodness i need to go buy them even more now things are getting worse so you’re always balancing the fear of the unknown with giving the best information and trying to predict what people’s habits are going to be it was there’s so much we could have done differently i i would i’m the first to say that but there were there were a lot of different dynamics at play yeah i mean right yeah yeah i mean i i agree that that that was a huge mistake to talk about the the masks in that in that context because it also made no no logical sense wait a minute so masks work for healthcare workers inside a hospital but there’s something magical about the walls of the hospital that when you leave there and you go into a grocery store or inside a congressional building or something else that now masks aren’t effective for the public but they are for health workers so it treats people like they can’t even sort through these these kind of basic elements so i think would have been better say look cloth masks are are effective n95s are better leave those for the nurses who are interacting with people who are currently positive you should make your own class cloth masks at home let’s have a national effort to produce as many as we can as rapidly as possible but i did want to talk about the israel numbers for a second because a lot of people are panicking about israel and i think it’s important to put in a context what happened so like about six months ago you know pfizer you know they went 100 pfizer and so just as the pfizer’s effectiveness is starting to wane you have that you have delta coming in and producing these these breakthrough infections but what’s really is important is that even though the case numbers in israel are the same as they were at the absolute peak the number of deaths is down by more than two-thirds so even the the waning vaccine is offering some significant protection among people over 60 who are in the hospital you’re nine times more likely to have been hospitalized and get a serious infection if you are unvaccinated if you’re over 60. for under 60 the data shows that you’re about twice as likely to get a serious infection if you’re unvaccinated relative to vaccinated and so but people keep focusing on this statistic that roughly half of the people in the hospital were fully vaccinated but that’s because 90 plus percent of the population is fully vaccinated so even though you’re nine times more likely you know to get hit with it if you’re unvaccinated there’s such a small population basically everybody who’s unvaccinated is getting whacked right now and going to the hospital and then a very small portion of the people who are vaccinated are getting hit and going to the hospital so basically the takeaway from that should be people who are vaccinated are much safer even though it is true that it’s waning and man it is unpleasant to think about the possibility that there might have to be boosters to keep this vaccine effectiveness going for the rest of our lives we don’t want to admit that we uh might be living in that world the rest of our lives well in one point that i’ve um tried to make to some of my friends on the right i think people are validly upset over this they’re tired of the government changing you know the goal posts and saying now you need this now you need this but one can’t be anti-mask anti-vaxx and anti-lockdowns unless you’re pro-virus you have to be okay with one of these mitigation tactics and willing to do it unless you’re saying i’m just going to let the virus thrive for those around me so that’s the one point i would make to people there are still obviously decisions that you can personally make for your health on whether or not to get vaccinated but then observe these other mitigation tactics because we are we are seeing hospitalizations go up we’re seeing kids get it more especially in the south and uh we’re seeing louisiana they’re at hospital capacity or icu capacity like we’ve got to be willing to do something to mitigate it but of course the science does seem to be ever-evolving and we need to be learning as we go yeah i mean it definitely is a constant shift and we have to be ready for that so uh ryan look forward to hearing what’s on your radar next
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Kim Iversen: Joe Rogan BLASTS Fauci For FLIP-FLOPPING, Ruining Public Trust In Health Experts

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